GUE Tech 1 VS. UTD Tech 1/2

[StreetDoctor]

I haven't found much information online that talks about the differences other than GUE Tech 1 is similar to UTD tech 2. Right now we're up in the air between taking a GUE Cave 1 class or a Tech class this winter. I'm heavily leaning towards the tech class as that's more useful for local diving in the Great Lakes area. Adventually I'm sure we'll do both.

The main difference I've seen so far is I believe UTD allows you to carry a bottom stage similar to GUE's new Tech 1+ rating which I'm not sure you can get right away? Is there any difference between decompression procedures or beliefs? What am I missing?

The main thing driving me towards UTD is location. From my experience the west coast diving is much more similar to the great lakes compared to florida. Logistically it's a bit harder because I'd most likely drive to florida with my own gear whereas to get to California I'd have to fly and worry about obtaining tanks. Does anyone care to weigh in their opinion?

Edit: I should mention my pre-technical training to date consists of TDI Intro to Tech and GUE Fundamentals.

[AzTek Diver]

I haven't found much information online that talks about the differences other than GUE Tech 1 is similar to UTD tech 2. Right now we're up in the air between taking a GUE Cave 1 class or a Tech class this winter. I'm heavily leaning towards the tech class as that's more useful for local diving in the Great Lakes area. Adventually I'm sure we'll do both.

The main difference I've seen so far is I believe UTD allows you to carry a bottom stage similar to GUE's new Tech 1+ rating which I'm not sure you can get right away? Is there any difference between decompression procedures or beliefs? What am I missing?

The main thing driving me towards UTD is location. From my experience the west coast diving is much more similar to the great lakes compared to florida. Logistically it's a bit harder because I'd most likely drive to florida with my own gear whereas to get to California I'd have to fly and worry about obtaining tanks. Does anyone care to weigh in their opinion?

Edit: I should mention my pre-technical training to date consists of TDI Intro to Tech and GUE Fundamentals.

Why would you drive to FL for Tech 1, wouldn't Bob Sherwood be a lot closer in NY?

[StreetDoctor]

Why would you drive to FL for Tech 1, wouldn't Bob Sherwood be a lot closer in NY?

We discussed that, one of the guys isn't really going to be able to get a big chunk of vacation time outside of January/February which makes taking it in PA or NY extremely cold. We'd also like to take the course outside of a quarry. We thought about attempting to take the class some where else on the east coast but weather and instructor availability won't really make that feasible. From what I understand winter in florida in a drysuit wouldn't be too bad, and we could drive all our own gear/tanks down. So it seems our options are really florida or california.... GUE or UTD. Right now I'm looking for any reason to choose one over the other. I've sent an email out to UTD as I'm really not sure what their pricing is for a combined Tech 1/2 course.

[rjack]

UTD T1/2 is really 2 classes split by a few months. GUE Tech1 is 5 to 7 days with a chance for a provisional which basically turns it into 2 (split) courses anyway.

UTD teaches/uses 25/25 whereas GUE does not. 30/30 outside of FL high flow caves is not very useful. Both use 21/35. GUE Tech1 allows 18/45 while UTD does not at this level. Not sure if these gas differences really add up to much.

UTD has a heavier (nearly exclusive) emphasis on ratio deco whereas GUE has moved more towards decoplanner over the past few years.

You could do GUE tech1 with Beto in Monterey, but I don't know if it meets your schedule. Obviously James Mott is close to you, he's in MI. And I imagine Dan Mackay with GUE is relatively close as well.

I would train in conditions similar to those in which you dive. Which suggests that setting up a local course might be best. If winter training is a dealbreaker I would consider going to BC or SoCal as well.

[StreetDoctor]

UTD T1/2 is really 2 classes split by a few months. GUE Tech1 is 5 to 7 days with a chance for a provisional which basically turns it into 2 (split) courses anyway.

UTD teaches/uses 25/25 whereas GUE does not. 30/30 outside of FL high flow caves is not very useful. Both use 21/35. GUE Tech1 allows 18/45 while UTD does not at this level. Not sure if these gas differences really add up to much.

UTD has a heavier (nearly exclusive) emphasis on ratio deco whereas GUE has moved more towards decoplanner over the past few years.

You could do GUE tech1 with Beto in Monterey, but I don't know if it meets your schedule. Obviously James Mott is close to you, he's in MI. And I imagine Dan Mackay with GUE is relatively close as well.

I would train in conditions similar to those in which you dive. Which suggests that setting up a local course might be best. If winter training is a dealbreaker I would consider going to BC or SoCal as well.

Very interesting, this is the kind of information I was looking for. I'll have to send an email to the UTD instructor in MI and maybe break the class up. Traveling to California for UTD Tech 1/2 at the same time appears to be out, a rough cost breakdown with airfare/hotel puts the cost around $3500+

[rjack]

You can do UTD Tech1/2 all in one go, but I don't know a single class which has done that yet. most split it up and dive at the tech1 level for awhile before moving onto part2.

I would talk to James about doing the skills part of the course late this winter with the experience dives early in your lake season. Then you'd have the whole summer to dive at the (UTD) Tech1 level if you wished. And/or take tech2 later in the summer if you wanted to.

[KMD]

If you came to California to train with Beto, logistics wouldn't be that bad. With BAUE out here we have a very large and thriving technical diving community that has plenty of gear that can be borrowed.

Its always interesting to hear people ask what is the difference between classes in X and Y organization. Inevitably it focuses on equipment, cost, & certification limits. Nobody ever seems to want to discuss perhaps the most important factor of any class: How good is the instructor?

[StreetDoctor]

If you came to California to train with Beto, logistics wouldn't be that bad. With BAUE out here we have a very large and thriving technical diving community that has plenty of gear that can be borrowed.

Its always interesting to hear people ask what is the difference between classes in X and Y organization. Inevitably it focuses on equipment, cost, & certification limits. Nobody ever seems to want to discuss perhaps the most important factor of any class: How good is the instructor?

If this was a PADI or TDI class the instructor would be my main concern... From agencys like GUE or UTD I would just assume that all of the instructors are top notch. If we were to go the UTD route we were planning on taking a few days break inbetween Tech 1 and 2. If we take the class more locally with James Mott it would be much more financially feasible to split them up a bit.

[jeff_s]

Shoot me an email at jeff@unifiedteamdiving, I'll be happy to discuss the various UTD options.

Best,

Jeff

[StreetDoctor]

Shoot me an email at jeff@unifiedteamdiving, I'll be happy to discuss the various UTD options.

Best,

Jeff

Jeff I really appreciate it, I have already emailed James Mott and lucky for us he dives throughout the winter also. We're trying to put together a Tech 1 class sometime in the coming months. Hopefully we'll be able to take Tech 2 with him in early summer before our trip to Florida in august.

[jeff_s]

Perfect. James is great.

Also, we just added two chapters to the Tech classroom: stage bottle handling and team positioning.

Best,

Jeff

Jeff I really appreciate it, I have already emailed James Mott and lucky for us he dives throughout the winter also. We're trying to put together a Tech 1 class sometime in the coming months. Hopefully we'll be able to take Tech 2 with him in early summer before our trip to Florida in august.

[KMD]

If this was a PADI or TDI class the instructor would be my main concern... From agencys like GUE or UTD I would just assume that all of the instructors are top notch. If we were to go the UTD route we were planning on taking a few days break inbetween Tech 1 and 2. If we take the class more locally with James Mott it would be much more financially feasible to split them up a bit.

Interesting. GUE has been around for 10 years so has a bit of history. UTD has been active for less than a year. So what are you basing the assumption on?

Not saying you are wrong mind you. Just commenting on peoples thought process.

[rjack]

If this was a PADI or TDI class the instructor would be my main concern... From agencys like GUE or UTD I would just assume that all of the instructors are top notch.

I would not assume that any instructor is "top notch" regardless of agency. Get references and remember most students have not taken a wide variety of courses and thus think their instructor is just awesome. During your interview process I recommend you think about how your interaction is: supportive, condescending, prompt replies, etc. The interview process is a microcosm of your course and your future relationship.

Lastly, if possible, I would recommend a local instructor that you can build a raporte with and continue to dive with 2,3,5 yrs from now.

[LCF]

Lastly, if possible, I would recommend a local instructor that you can build a raporte with and continue to dive with 2,3,5 yrs from now.

This is key. This is one of the things the DIR community in Seattle lacked for a long time. It's one of the things I respect and admire Brian Weiderspan for the most -- he is out there diving; doing his own dives, and diving with his students. You need that to help build a community. Find out if your instructor dives regularly.

[StreetDoctor]

Interesting. GUE has been around for 10 years so has a bit of history. UTD has been active for less than a year. So what are you basing the assumption on?

Not saying you are wrong mind you. Just commenting on peoples thought process.

Good point, I've done some very light research on UTD with a lot of it being word of mouth, some of it from locals I respect. I'll definitely do more but from what I see so far I like. I believe my DIR 'mentor' is attempting to become a UTD instructor but that is just a hunch of mine, maybe he'll chime in here and confirm.

I definitely agree about local instructors and continuing the relationship, as I've seen first hand how this really helps. Having more people to dive with is also always a plus. I like the fact that UTD has a some-what local instructor in James Mott and it appears he has a decent amount of experience on the great lakes, he also shares a common interest in diving (wrecks). GUE's closest Tech 1 instructor would be Dan Mackay or Bob Sherwood. I like the fact that UTD's class is broken up as it will make it MUCH easier to do with work. We were planning on doing this if we took GUE tech 1 and having to drive 12+ hours twice to PA, or paying for an instructor to come here twice is really hard on the budget.. Staying there for 7-10 days is hard on the vacation time just for training. I like to use my vacation time for real 'experience' dives